Getting my hands dirty with a chromebook!

retro junkie · May 01, 2023, 10:32:48 AM

I am going into this thing totally blind. Never took thought of the chomebook before. First some background. Since we have retired, and the pandemic thing, we have started to do more things online, like paying our bills, banking, shopping, etc. Security has become a concern. We have been using macbook pros for a number of years now, but the OS has become non supported by apple as it is now a thing of the past. I can still use the macbook offline to do a lot of things that I use one of these for, but online..........well that is the cause now for concern. I don't go to sites that are questionable, or shady. But you never know when, or if, you might just pick up something. Right now the most secure PC I have in the house is a lenovo IBM thinkpad R60. It still has IBM on it, LOL, that should give you an idea of how old this thing is. I have MX linux running great on it, like a new computer really. My desktop is a lenovo thinkcentre m58e 7298 which was released in 2009. I am getting ready to back it up and put MX linux on it. (I need to get out of the 32bit world.)

Sooo... a chromebook grabbed my interest in wanting to know what they are and how could they be used in every day menial tasks. The one that I am using to type this, I found on ebay for $44 free shipping. They started out with 105 of them and as I was looking around pondering if I should take the plunge, they had dwindled down to the last one and I grabbed it up. In my research I suddenly found out that they have an expiration date when they are no longer supported. I also found out that the one I had purchased had expired, and then I ran across the info that they had extended the life another two years. That was the first thing I did when I took it out of the package, updated the OS. And sure enough I have support in updates to the security of the OS until June 2025. That makes it usable for me to do banking and stuff until I get a handle on where I want to go at this point. Got to consider all options.

So here I have this lenovo N23 yoga. It is tiny compared to what I am used to, 11.6" touch screen. Battery has 7.5 hours of life, which is down from what it would be new. Four gigs of ram and a 32gig hard drive. It is hard for me to wrap my head around the thought that this originally sold for around $300. Chromebooks are a stripped down laptop built around a browser, chrome, by google. Sure they have other things that you can do with them as I am learning, word processing, etc. And they have become a big item in the school industry and some businesses, especially since the pandemic. This might explain the pricing and marketing.

So far my experience has been, I can see where this can be used for some things but it cannot replace a "real" laptop. I see the benefit that it contributes to the school system and the reason for the limitations. I have found it sluggish at times, like when I was using the bluetooth for a set of headphones, using a mouse. I have only had it for a few days but I am putting it through everything I can think of. Love learning about things like this, and it is a learning experience for me. The biggest shock I had, was to use it, all I had to do is log into it with my email account and my password. And this was the shock, syncing it with my chrome on my macbook. It pulled all my bookmarks and passwords from that laptop, chrome to chrome. I had no idea that my security was that venerable. Everything hinging on the simplicity or complexity of my password to my email, just because I am using the chrome browser.

I will explore this thing over this next month and just see how much this can be used for the fun part of just being on the net. I love learning about these things. A new toy.

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CreepinDeth · May 01, 2023, 11:33:59 PM

Chromebooks are decent little machines. The Google app suite is really solid. My company uses Google Docs and Sheets all the time. They're pretty powerful and you don't need to store everything locally. I started taking free online classes from Coursera to learn them and I haven't felt a need to go back to Microsoft yet.

I've thought about getting one just as a general purpose laptop, but as you saw @retro junkie , the OS can become outdated quickly depending on the manufacturer. Glad yours decided to extend it a couple more years. Not bad for $44.

I do recommend setting up Google's 2FA security if you haven't already as well. It's pretty convenient if you have an Android phone.

retro junkie · May 06, 2023, 09:51:10 PM

@CreepinDeth never thought too much about the 2FA until now, it is a must. This Chromebook is solid and I am enjoying it. I grabbed up a Lenovo thinkpad edge e531, i5-3230M for $44. They were having trouble with it. When I got it I was surprised to see that it was running windows 10 Pro. The issue that it had was the need for a new CMOS battery. The laptop is in mint condition and it does not look like it was ever used. I logged into my Microsoft account and I am good to go with a full windows 10 pro. The laptop does not meet requirements for a windows 11 update. I am not concerned about that at the moment being that I have two more years of security updates for windows 10. I also have two more years on the Chromebook. I have plenty of time to decide on which route I will be taking. Presently I am looking seriously in going toward ChromeOS or a Linux distro. I presently am running MX linux on my Lenovo thinkcentre desktop, it is debian based and it is solid as a rock. One thing I find very irritating about the e531 is the offset touch pad located to the far left of the laptop. This is the most stupidest thing in design that I have ever seen. Every 15" screen laptop that I have had, it was located in the middle.

retro junkie · May 11, 2023, 02:36:19 PM

Through my research I am finding that the most secure OS is made possible by those who support in maintaining the system. And the most secure computer is one that is never attached to the internet. I guess that is the importance of using an OS that is current. In comparing Windows, Linux, MacOS, and Chrome, there is really none that can really give you the most protection over the other. And yes, Windows gets the most exposure due to it being the most used and therefore the biggest target. Each OS has its own way of handling security. It depends largely on how the User handles their own important info and files combined with the usage of their computer's OS. There is the idea of using several computers, one for internet access, one to store your passwords and important files, which never is attached to the internet. Maybe one to work on, and one for purchasing and paying bills? That has been suggested by some of the information I was looking into. That's still sort-of tricky. I have enough computers laying around to do that. It is an idea to toy with, even if it tends to be somewhat impractical and inefficient.

So far, my direction is first, and foremost, to use an OS that is being supported, up to date. I love chromebook at this point. I have the Windows 10 laptop. And I have MX Linux running on my desktop, which is current and supported. My Macbook Pro will become my password keeper. Chrome and MX Linux will be my bill payer, and the Windows 10 will be my internet surfer. I have support for the MX Linux until the Debian stable base changes, three years from now. Maybe?

BLUEVOODU · May 12, 2023, 08:00:46 AM

@retro junkie - what brought you to the Chrome Book world instead of going back with Apple?

Security is a relative term, but I will go on the record to state that I trust Google products the least... not biased as I used them forever, but kept having several incidents happen over multiple android phones that were not coincidence... especially after locking down the privacy settings.

I ended up going to Apple... which I had previously sworn off. But they did make their product better, and my alternatives were dwindling.

I have not made it to a Chrome Book yet, but I do see the appeal to many.

retro junkie · May 12, 2023, 10:16:06 AM

@BLUEVOODU really I would love to go Macbook, but presently "money" seems to be the problem. I would need to save for a while in order to purchase something that would be long term. They have gone to the M2 chips moving away from the PC norm of Intel and Celeron. Support for anything below M2 will wain and fizzle out. It is expensive to stay in the Apple world. I have a late 2012 Macbook Pro that is running Mojave. I could be running Catalina, but Adobe PhotoShop does not run in it. I am talking about the Photoshop that you own, not the one you use by subscription. There are things you face like that which are important. I do like Krita and have started to use it more, but I would need to make a choice. Linux is probably where I will land at some point. The Chromebook and Windows 10 Pro cannot be long term. They are one of those temporary hold points where I catch my breath. I wish I could continue to use my Macbook, but at some point, in the future there will be conflicts between it and websites due to changing technology. And then there is the security issue, which I have never had a problem with. But then again, I have never depended on my computer for banking, bill pay, shopping, etc, like I do now. So I don't know what to expect. I can't see myself committing to Chromebook due to the limitations of the support and the high difficulty they go to make it a closed hardware. Closed as in making where you cannot install any other OS. There are certain models that allow you to install Linux, but you have to do your research.

I try to get by as cheap as I can on stuff like this. Not having a job now and on a fixed income results in some financial limitations, I am still learning. But I can save up and look toward a purchase. That is why I have said above that I have two years of support on a couple of things, the Chrome and the Win 10. Not sure about the Win 10. The Chrome is pretty solid, based on Linux. It being a small OS that has one goal of building itself around a browser, it should be very easy to maintain by the support group. I like the office program. I was skeptical at first but wanted to learn more about what "it is." I saw it as a learning experience. I could use it for just about everything I do except for graphics and picture editing.
And then there is MX Linux, I feel at home with it, even though it is on old 2009 hardware.

Curiosity is what caused me to look at a Chromebook. And the fact I got a new toy.

BLUEVOODU · May 12, 2023, 11:28:03 AM

Yeah... I totally get you on the expense and fixed income. Totally makes sense and Apple really is expensive. Almost anything is these days, but especially Apple. I had a sticker shock upgrading my phone. I'll run it for a few years, but there was a sticker shock for sure. I'm a bit surprised there hasn't been more of a backlash on Apple to reduce costs... but people still keep paying it.

It's funny you mentioned IBM... I miss the Thinkpad when IBM made it. Lenovo is alright... definitely owned 2-3 of those devices and they worked well. The Yoga didn't last as long as I hoped. It was awesome and thin! The connections on the inside were so thin, you had to be EXTREMELY careful not to break the keyboard ribbons. I definitely loved the Yoga for the portability and decent power it had back in the Ultrabook days. Not sure the term Ultrabook is relevant anymore

Please update as you keep exploring it... I'm curious what your thoughts are as you keep moving along your Chrome Book journey.

retro junkie · May 13, 2023, 04:49:48 PM

Brace yourself, this is going to be a little long. This might be a last update for a while and anymore will be my experience in using it. But really, I am using it now. I will wait a month and then give more feels.

I, in no way, am recommending, or promoting Chromebooks. I am trying to be honest about my findings. Chromebooks seem to be a major investment that one would have to set back and weigh in a fixed set of pros and cons. I, personally, like purchasing something that I can wear out. That is why I still have a "square screen" 2006 thinkpad R60 that is still usable with an up-to-date Linux OS. I purchased this thinkpad with no ram, battery, or hard drive, and I am thinking it was something like $30 free ship. I think my 2009 thinkcentre m58e was about the same price, and condition. Both are good reliable, old, but usable. For how long, don't know. That is why I am here, I guess. Personally, I would rather have a Macbook Pro that is up-to-date, but that is not feasible at this time. The 2012 Macbook Pro that I have is going to be used with my Wacom tablet and to safely store my passwords.

On a side note, I have noticed that they are now starting to support the newer Chromebooks for eight years. Looking at a new Chromebook, for example, 14" screen HP 14b-cb0033dx, selling for $289. I would divide that by eight years which would equal something like $36 a year for the security updates. That is the only way I could justify purchasing one new. And I would need to make sure it was released the year I purchased. That is an option in the future, two years from now. After it expired, it could be used for a general-purpose computer, offline documents, or just to surf the net, news, ebooks, read info, etc.

The big Achillies heel of the Chromebook is the AUE date (Auto Update Expiration). That is the date where it no longer receives updates to the OS. After that point you may become vulnerable, you're on your own, but you can still use your Chromebook. You just might not want to do any banking with it, or similar activities. This "end of life" with the Chromebook is tied up in the security and reliability that they build into the product. Being that they target schools and businesses as their end user market, they focus on the security and reliability of the Chromebook. It is in the design of the book. As I understand, the hardware verifies, and authenticates, the OS every time you boot up, which would mean that the OS is located in two places. The hardware and the OS are mated together and merged into each other. That is why it is difficult to try and install another OS onto the book. The hardware looks for the ChromeOS and verifies it is free from any contamination. And being that the OS is intentionally small, it is easier to plug the holes, than, in something that is as complex as Windows, MacOS, or Linux. Each Chromebook model has an AUE date. That means if you go into a store to purchase one off the shelf it could be in the middle of that support cycle, or at the end. Somehow, I feel that the consumer, in some way, should be aware. Researching is the key and a school, or business would be aware of something like this, right, or you would think they would? There is concern when a website recommends the "top best Chromebooks for 2023" with many of them at the end of that AUE date. Not right.

Studying a lot about the security of the book has given me a lot of confidence in the product with a little bit of caution in the back of my gut. Nothing is perfect. But it does sound like they have a good thing. I would agree with some of the info I've found, that, they are, more secure than a school system or a business trying to handle their own security with their own cloud. And the Chromebook is connected to a cloud. You must face your own demons as to how you feel about that. You can save a copy to the built-in small hard drive, flash drive, or to an SD card. Being that it is connected to a cloud, if your Chromebook died, all you need, is to get another Chromebook, sign in, and you're up and running with no data lost. And everything is encrypted to your username and password.

What are they good for?

In a school or business, they can be used by the teacher, or manager, whichever the case may be, to tie together the class, employees, staff, to the master book. Lessons, reading material, information, can be dumped to all of the books. Everybody can be on the same page. Parental controls can be implemented by the teacher, parent, or business manager. They are designed for "zoom" meetings and it is the reason that their sales boomed during the pandemic.

They are good for net surfing, email, social sites like facebook, ebooks, YouTube watching, music, etc. You can carry out your business, like banking, bill paying, shopping, online transactions of any sort, etc. There are a lot of things in the google app store. They have a good office program. I have used it to produce documents and I am very well pleased with the grammar and spell checking. If needed there is an app where you can connect with your main computer or something else, like a network, so that you can use "Microsoft office" in a window on your Chromebook. Using a small Chromebook, it is easy to carry one to a coffee shop, or where ever, for lite work, or the net. They are very responsive yet sluggish at times when loading certain web pages, excessive activity and busy pages. I can't complain. I am satisfied with the performance of my Chromebook. (I am retired so I have plenty of time to put it through everything that I will be using it.) I never thought I would like this 11" screen, but I have no issue with it. Even though it has touch screen abilities, there are some activities in which I prefer using a cordless mouse. One "con" only one USB port, 3.0.

Caution is needed in being concerned about security if you turn on the Linux side in order to download Linux programs, or install android programs, small games. As I have read this would give you the ability to install Steam, but you are limited by the CPU in these things. With the Linux side you can do coding, write programs. Some of them do have that option and ability. The ChromeOS is like any other OS if they have their own repository of programs. Their own stuff they can watch over and contain any issues. But when you start getting out of that box then you need to use your own judgement. I will not be doing any of this stuff so it is a non-issue with me. My book does have this capability.

(An Option: Most of the time you can pick up a good used Chromebook that has expired which would be a good computer for general use in the price range of around $20, or more. If you want one for a child, with the parental controls you can control, and limit, the sites they can visit, just saying.)

One thing about the Chromebook battery is that they charge fast and last a long time. And the books are ruggedly built for the environment they are intended, schools and businesses.

I can see this as only being a second computer to compliment your main rig. Unless your needs are simple, then this is all you need. I know many people that are like that, my Wife for example. She would not need anything more than this for what she does on a computer. If you are into computer gaming or some other heavy programs where you need power, ram, and space, this is not going to cut it. Chromebooks are not designed for it.

If you are tech savvy, I would suggest looking for one that you can change out the eMMC for a larger one. In most of these books it is soldered. Some don't, it is a simple unplug, plug-in, of the eMMC. At first, I thought these things had an SSD, but they don't, they use eMMC for storage on the book itself.

Believe me, my next updates will be shorter!

retro junkie · May 26, 2023, 10:40:41 PM

My Chromebook Journey
There is definitely a learning curve in using a Chromebook, and I am still learning.

I guess I have committed myself to the ChromeOS ecosystem. I found this refurbished ASUS 17.3" Chromebook on eBay, the ASUS Chromebook CX1700CKA-DH44. The seller has a bunch of them, still selling them too. They are manufacturer refurbished with a 2 year warranty. I looked it up and found out that this model was released last year, and it is supported until June 2030. At $99 with free shipping & handling, I couldn't resist. This is a good deal. I received mine today. You might as well say they are brand new condition.
One big plus is that I have a drawing tablet, ONE by Wacom, that works with the ChromeOS. I even was able to install Krita the drawing program that I use.
I helped my Wife to set-up the Lenovo Chromebook today for her to use. I need this ASUS 17.3" screen. The size of the built-in eMMc hard drive is really irrelevant when you can simply add whatever you want with a flash-drive, SD, or an external SSD. Which at some point I will do. It will be fairly inexpensive to just add a 256g micro-SD to the ASUS, which has a 64g eMMC.

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retro junkie · May 27, 2023, 03:06:38 PM

There is definitely a big difference in the performance of the ASUS over the Lenovo. The ASUS has an Intel Celeron 64bit CPU vs the Arm8.2 32bit Lenovo CPU.
I can see the ASUS as a business Chromebook and the Lenovo for the classroom. Just the styling and build alone gives me those feels.
I really like and enjoy the Google Office suite. I was working on some spread sheets today and it seemed, to me, to be more user friendly than Microsoft Office.

CreepinDeth · May 28, 2023, 08:17:52 PM

This topic has been really tempting me to get one. I actually needed a new budget laptop for work purposes and unfortunately need Windows for VPN software. Settled for an Acer Aspire 5.

I plan to kind of treat it as a chromebook. Do everything through the Google Suite and leave the internal storage clear of files as much as I can. I love Google Sheets. It's gotten to the point that Microsoft Excel (although much more powerful) feels bloated to me.

@retro junkie Let us know how the Wacom works. Would be good to see a cheaper alternative to an iPad/iPad Pro.

BLUEVOODU · May 30, 2023, 08:49:36 PM

Asus really has a nice lineup for the most part. Outside the proc differences (which will be very noticeable as you noticed)... the form and fit of Asus is great. I used to really love IBM laptops and computers... Lenovo also has a great lineup, but Asus has really edged Lenovo out in my personal preference.

That's cool you have a Wacom @retro junkie --> I've always wanted to try one (especially back in the day when I did more with computer graphics). I am also curious how your setup plays out.

I personally have a hard time settling up to Google. That's just me though...

retro junkie · May 30, 2023, 10:33:09 PM

@CreepinDeth my tablet ONE by Wacom works great. At first I thought I was a little rusty using it because I have been using a Wacom that has a color screen, that one is not compatible with ChromeOS. But it is the Krita that is somewhat buggy. There are other drawing programs for ChromeOS, I have been trying out Concepts. It is great and the Wacom tablet works like pencil and paper.

@BLUEVOODU i have two tablets by Wacom, the ONE and a Wacom DTU-1031X that has a color screen. I have never owned an ASUS product. I really like this laptop so far. I think some would find an issue with the number keys, they are 1/4 narrower than regular keys on a laptop this size.

retro junkie · June 01, 2023, 06:14:42 PM

I had a concern on whether I could use my scan feature on my HP printer. None of the programs or apps had very good ratings. While searching I ran across the instructions of opening up the app menu and using the search function to type in scan. Chromebook has a built in scan program, or app, who knew. Works great, very satisfied.

I a lot of times may sketch something with a lead pencil and paper. And I like scanning those in to work with using a Wacom tablet and some drawing program.

retro junkie · June 05, 2023, 03:40:06 PM

I am determined.

So I am limiting myself to the Chromebook, on purpose, to learn. By doing that I am figuring out how to do things by using the Chromebook only. Today I did a drawing, scanned it in, and pulled it up into Concepts. Using this drawing program, I used my Wacom ONE tablet and colored the drawing using layers. Next I used an online drawing program, Sumopaint X, to add text to the drawing. I used two different programs because I knew I could do the task needed in each. I have only scratched the surface of how to use Concepts. I need to look up instructions and read, experiment, and learn more. I could have done everything in the online Sumopaint X. I keep digging into this Chromebook and finding more things it can do. I definitely can do Photo editing.

One thing I do know about the Chromebook, the 64-bit processor is the route to go. The experience is like night and day when comparing it to the 32-bit Lenovo I have. Even the online experience.

retro junkie · June 08, 2023, 08:09:36 PM

Just made my storage space bigger. With a built in hard drive of 64gb, this should compliment it nicely. An extra 256gb will put my mind at ease.

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retro junkie · June 12, 2023, 11:20:15 AM

To be honest there were two concerns using this thing. One was 4gb ram and the other 64gb of storage. There was the fact that this laptop's processor was low powered too. So low powered that there is no fan, but it does not even get warm. I was conscious of these things going into this expecting at some point experiencing the result. But after digging into this Chromebook since May 26th, I no longer even consider or think about it. I have fully adapted to my daily tasks and routines to its use.

CreepinDeth · June 13, 2023, 01:57:34 AM

@retro junkie You sound like me back when I took the full plunge to Linux a year and a half ago. It has since become my daily driver computer.

You're seriously piquing the tinkerer in me and I really want to get a chromebook now, lol. I started looking into them more and stumbled across this website - Chrome Unboxed. Check it out if you haven't already.

retro junkie · June 21, 2023, 04:32:12 PM

The Chromebook definitely has a place, not sure what kind of impact it is having on the laptop world. In 2021 zdnet had an article announcing Chromebooks dominating the PC market with 75% annual growth. In that same year it was said that they overtook MAC sales for the first time. I can see that happening, being the target marketing is toward schools and businesses.
I can say at this point that I am sold on the idea. I know some may have reservations just because google is behind the concept. I understand, I have the same feelings toward Microsoft and its Windows.
I have either found workarounds, for the things I need in a computer, or what has been supplied is sufficient. And if I need something special, I go to my MX Linux desktop, or my ole Macbook Pro. For the security online I will trust that to the Chrome OS for the next seven years and its updates. That is what I was seeking.
The Chromebook is fast up and going the moment you open it up. You are working in an instant. I have yet to figure out the cut and paste with a right click, so I just use the shortcuts on the keyboard. And if I want a picture from online somewhere, I just drag and drop it in a file. There is a learning curve, but once you get past that, everything becomes intuitive.
I would say that Chromebooks are a good laptop for Seniors. For casual computer users this concept would be a good choice if all you need can be found in a low powered laptop sporting 4gb of ram.

@CreepinDeth and yes it does remind me of my early days of exploring the use of linux too.

retro junkie · June 22, 2023, 10:44:18 AM

Okay..............
I just figured out the cut and paste. Two finger tap brings up a menu.

retro junkie · June 29, 2023, 09:49:25 PM

Okay now I get it. The two finger tap is used for a lot of different functions, depending on what the cursor is on. Highlight a word, cut and paste, on a photo, save as, on a link, open in a new tab, etc.

BLUEVOODU · July 28, 2023, 03:51:44 PM

@retro junkie yeah... I was getting accustomed to some of the Apple shortcuts as well. Then the Apple Pen shortcuts...etc..etc.

That's cool you're getting accustomed to your new device. This is a bit after your last post... are you running circles around it now?

retro junkie · July 31, 2023, 03:07:43 PM

@BLUEVOODU really I have settled in and it has become my daily. Everything is working out well. I am getting spoiled to the instant on boot up, that is fast. Really impressed with it all. I save my stuff to the SD card and with that I am satisfied. I can work offline with the google office, streaming works well, accessing everything that I need to. I am presently on a waiting list for 200 mbps net speed over fiber optics,unlimited data usage. Should have it up and going within the next few weeks. That will make an even bigger difference.

This has been a good option for me at this present time.